I was thinking it might've been more along the lines of Lucifer and Michael not needing their vessels and/or them being separated by the mechanics of the cage. Sam seemed to have some memories of his time in the cage and also these visions seem to be more like flashbacks to his time in the cage that God triggered than what we would consider to be the typical visions. Seeing as it's a cage built for trapping an Archangel it is possible that it renders them unable to possess a host body while their in the cage and therefore forcibly removes them from a host body. This could support what I recall of how Sam does have horrible traumatic memories of time in the cage. It also could explain how Castiel was able to pull Sam's body outta the cage without bringing Luci along for the ride too. After all Lucifer is stronger than Castiel, so it does make you wonder how Castiel forced him outta Sam's body.
So going off the assumption that the 2 Archangels Lucifer and Michael weren't possessing the two Winchesters in the cage then you could say that Adam would know about how Castiel extracted Sam's body from the cage and how later Death extracted Sam's soul from the cage. Though I guess soon enough we will find out more about the mechanics of how the cage works seeing as Sam and possibly Dean too shall be visiting Hell to access the cage to get the help of Lucifer and possibly Michael too in defeating God's sister, the Darkness.
The mechanics of Lucifer's Cage definitely are intriguing, that's for sure. I imagined it being a more advanced version of a Devil's Trap and Angel Trap, specifically built to keep Lucifer locked up. With the standard traps mentioned, once the intended supernatural being crosses over its perimeters, the being can't cross back over - spirit or body - until the perimeter is broken. Furthermore, the supernatural being is unable to use their typical powers (such as exiting out of their vessel). Supernatural beings that are not the intended target are not captured in said traps (like how Castiel can easily walk through a Demon's Trap with no issue). However, when I start thinking about what we know about the Cage, I begin to question whether this ideology applies to it as well. We know that once locked back up in the Cage, Lucifer tortured Sam - but did he do this from the inside out or did Lucifer manage to spirit out and torture Sam from the outside like Alistair did with Dean? If the same mechanics of the traps apply to the Cage, then the former would make sense, especially when Sam started imagining Lucifer once he was back topside and regained his memories of his hellish adventures in the Cage.
In terms of flashback memories, you have to take into consideration that there's a difference between being possessed by a supernatural being and not. Dean had memories of his time in hell because he had died and gone there on his own, no supernatural being involved. For Sam, he has memories of being in the cage probably because Lucifer specifically intended for that to happen - he was torturing him after all. Why torture him and not let him recall all of the details of being in the worse place in hell? Generally when an angel or demon occupies a vessel, the original consciousness of the human is suppressed, though it can come to the surface in rare instances - Jimmy Novak recognized Dean and Sam after Castiel was expelled from his body, and Sam managed to overpower Lucifer to regain full control of his body and jump into the Cage (taking Michael/Adam with him). Conversely, angels can suppress themselves from their vessels knowledge, like how Ezekiel hid within Sam's subconscious without Sam realizing he was possessed. So, when it comes to Adam, it depends on how both parties (Adam and Michael) are acting in the situation. Is Michael keeping Adam's mind suppressed, or is he letting Adam see the hellish environment in the Cage as a form of torture like Lucifer does with Sam ((especially when you consider the fact that Adam has Winchester blood in him; the angels hate the Winchesters, so it wouldn't be too surprised that Michael would take advantage of the situation))? And conversely, is Adam strong enough to overpower Michael (like Sam previously did with Lucifer) or is his inexperience with being possessed getting in the way?
It brings out the question of, if you version of the Lucifer's Cage's mechanics are correct then how was Castiel able to pull Sam out without getting stuck himself in the process and therefore failing to do so? Tho I guess we shall find out soon enough how it works seeing as they'll be returning to the Cage to get help from Lucifer and possibly Michael too.
I wonder tho what they might hafta exchange in order to get Lucifer's help. It might even be possible that Lucifer will only provide the help or is only able to provide the help if he is in his one true vessel, Sam Winchester. Also in freeing Lucifer and possibly Michael too, I imagine they risk starting either another Apocalypse &/or a hostile take over(s) of Heaven &/or Hell.
If the Cage was made to trap archangels, specifically Lucifer, then it probably wouldn't capture Castiel, since he's a regular angel. In terms of hierarchy, he's below archangels but still pretty high up the ladder, hence the reason why all of the other angels keep looking to him as a leader of sorts. However, with him still being an angel, it's possible some of the Cage's mechanics may have messed with Castiel's powers... and maybe the reason why Sam's soul got left behind.
Things will definitely get interesting if Lucifer and Michael are released from the cage, that's for sure.
Makes sense. So you think that the Cage would also make them practically powerless, while Castiel might only be weakened by the Cage when he entered it to get Sam out? Is that what you're thinking allowed Castiel to overpower Lucifer and free Sam's body since you still think it was possessed by Lucifer when Castiel came to save Sam from the Cage? So I guess both of our predictions about how the Cage works make sense then.
Well at least we'll get one more episode closer to their return and us finding out how the Cage functions after tomorrow night's episode airs. Speaking of that, how many episodes more do you think we'll hafta watch until we get to the episode where at least Sam goes to Hell to get help from Lucifer &/or Michael?
If the mechanics of the angel and demon traps apply to the Cage, just on a higher level to deal with an archangel, then yeah, they essentially would be unable to use their angel powers ((supernatural beings still seem to have control of the level of conciousness of their vessel however, as we saw with Ruby #1 - so Lucifer could easily torment Sam without having to use his powers)). If Lucifer was still possessing Sam's body when in the cage, it's possible Castiel used the Angel Exorcism incantation ((which we first see in 4.16; Alastair tried using it on Castiel but Sam interrupted)) or a variation to expel Lucifer from Sam. *shrugs* Hard to say for certain since we know very little about the Cage at this time.
Well, I can't say for certain since I don't know what's going on plot wise in the current episodes yet. I figure it will be relatively soon, probably when Supernatural returns after the winter hiatus. I suspect there will probably be an episode or two of Sam (and Dean?) going down to hell, seeing the Cage again after such a long time and encountering the angelic brothers (Lucifer and Michael), and then figuring out how to release them and get back topside.
I must've missed that episode where Alastair tried to do that to Castiel or just forgotten about it. Tho that makes sense that he could've done something like that had Lucifer still been possessing Sam.
I'd imagine they'll probably get help getting in and outta Heaven from Crowley seeing as they're such great frienemies with him and how they now seem to have the common enemy in the Darkness. Tho Crowley might be reluctant to do it since it would mean they need to free his old boss and that would mean that he'd hafta probably end up fighting against Lucifer at some point over who is in charge of Hell.
So do you think Michael would join the current regime of Heaven upon his return or do you think he'll try to stage a coup d'etat? (Not necessarily before the defeat of the Darkness) Honestly if he wanted to stage a coup d'etat, I don't think there is much that the angels in Heaven could to stop him seeing as he probably will still have all his powers unless of course the Cage has weakened him &/or the fight against the Darkness will weaken him.
On an unrelated note to the above "Spoiler" Conversation. I found this Supernatural Ani-Gif on Facebook.
Posted: Wed Dec 09, 2015 10:35 pm
Prof. Moonie
SPN S11 Mid-Season Finale Spoilers (Below)
OMFG that was fantastic. Too bad we're gonna hafta wait a while until the next episode.
As Sam visited the Cage with Rowena and Crowley, Dean had an encounter with the Darkness. In Hell, Lucifer of course tries to convince Sam to let him possess Sam. When Sam refuses, Lucifer teleported Sam inside the Cage and then revealed that God wasn't sending Sam the visions, but instead his truly was sending the visions to Sam because the Cage had been damaged enough for Lucifer to use some of his powers when the Darkness was released. Up topside, Amara spoke to Dean about how they're destined to become one since he freed her. She also has a fight with 3 "Fluffy Winged Dickhead" Grunts who she dispatches with the simplest of ease.
Damn I can't wait to see the second half of this season. Well too bad cryogenic stasis pods like in Futurama don't exist because I might very well be tempted to freeze myself in one of them for a few weeks so I wouldn't hafta wait for the next episode that long. I'm as excited as the below random anime character.
It brings out the question of, if you version of the Lucifer's Cage's mechanics are correct then how was Castiel able to pull Sam out without getting stuck himself in the process and therefore failing to do so? Tho I guess we shall find out soon enough how it works seeing as they'll be returning to the Cage to get help from Lucifer and possibly Michael too.
I wonder tho what they might hafta exchange in order to get Lucifer's help. It might even be possible that Lucifer will only provide the help or is only able to provide the help if he is in his one true vessel, Sam Winchester. Also in freeing Lucifer and possibly Michael too, I imagine they risk starting either another Apocalypse &/or a hostile take over(s) of Heaven &/or Hell.
If the Cage was made to trap archangels, specifically Lucifer, then it probably wouldn't capture Castiel, since he's a regular angel. In terms of hierarchy, he's below archangels but still pretty high up the ladder, hence the reason why all of the other angels keep looking to him as a leader of sorts. However, with him still being an angel, it's possible some of the Cage's mechanics may have messed with Castiel's powers... and maybe the reason why Sam's soul got left behind.
Things will definitely get interesting if Lucifer and Michael are released from the cage, that's for sure.
Makes sense. So you think that the Cage would also make them practically powerless, while Castiel might only be weakened by the Cage when he entered it to get Sam out? Is that what you're thinking allowed Castiel to overpower Lucifer and free Sam's body since you still think it was possessed by Lucifer when Castiel came to save Sam from the Cage? So I guess both of our predictions about how the Cage works make sense then.
Well at least we'll get one more episode closer to their return and us finding out how the Cage functions after tomorrow night's episode airs. Speaking of that, how many episodes more do you think we'll hafta watch until we get to the episode where at least Sam goes to Hell to get help from Lucifer &/or Michael?
If the mechanics of the angel and demon traps apply to the Cage, just on a higher level to deal with an archangel, then yeah, they essentially would be unable to use their angel powers ((supernatural beings still seem to have control of the level of conciousness of their vessel however, as we saw with Ruby #1 - so Lucifer could easily torment Sam without having to use his powers)). If Lucifer was still possessing Sam's body when in the cage, it's possible Castiel used the Angel Exorcism incantation ((which we first see in 4.16; Alastair tried using it on Castiel but Sam interrupted)) or a variation to expel Lucifer from Sam. *shrugs* Hard to say for certain since we know very little about the Cage at this time.
Well, I can't say for certain since I don't know what's going on plot wise in the current episodes yet. I figure it will be relatively soon, probably when Supernatural returns after the winter hiatus. I suspect there will probably be an episode or two of Sam (and Dean?) going down to hell, seeing the Cage again after such a long time and encountering the angelic brothers (Lucifer and Michael), and then figuring out how to release them and get back topside.
I must've missed that episode where Alastair tried to do that to Castiel or just forgotten about it. Tho that makes sense that he could've done something like that had Lucifer still been possessing Sam.
I'd imagine they'll probably get help getting in and outta Heaven from Crowley seeing as they're such great frienemies with him and how they now seem to have the common enemy in the Darkness. Tho Crowley might be reluctant to do it since it would mean they need to free his old boss and that would mean that he'd hafta probably end up fighting against Lucifer at some point over who is in charge of Hell.
So do you think Michael would join the current regime of Heaven upon his return or do you think he'll try to stage a coup d'etat? (Not necessarily before the defeat of the Darkness) Honestly if he wanted to stage a coup d'etat, I don't think there is much that the angels in Heaven could to stop him seeing as he probably will still have all his powers unless of course the Cage has weakened him &/or the fight against the Darkness will weaken him.
On an unrelated note to the above "Spoiler" Conversation. I found this Supernatural Ani-Gif on Facebook.
Oh, I'm sure Crowley will get involved in helping the Winchesters one way or another, despite his feelings for his former boss. From what I've seen of Crowley and the Darkness' interaction, he's realizing that he bit off more than he can chew and regretting what he's done.
If Michael survives the battle with the Darkness and is allowed to go his own way afterwards, I'm sure he'll try to go back up to heaven. As for whether he'll try to take over as leader or not, it's hard to say. Depends on how the other angels feel about him now and whether he's happy with how things are being run up there or not.
Posted: Thu Dec 10, 2015 3:00 pm
Prof. Moonie
Kor Saiyajinkami
Prof. Moonie
Kor Saiyajinkami
Prof. Moonie
If the Cage was made to trap archangels, specifically Lucifer, then it probably wouldn't capture Castiel, since he's a regular angel. In terms of hierarchy, he's below archangels but still pretty high up the ladder, hence the reason why all of the other angels keep looking to him as a leader of sorts. However, with him still being an angel, it's possible some of the Cage's mechanics may have messed with Castiel's powers... and maybe the reason why Sam's soul got left behind.
Things will definitely get interesting if Lucifer and Michael are released from the cage, that's for sure.
Makes sense. So you think that the Cage would also make them practically powerless, while Castiel might only be weakened by the Cage when he entered it to get Sam out? Is that what you're thinking allowed Castiel to overpower Lucifer and free Sam's body since you still think it was possessed by Lucifer when Castiel came to save Sam from the Cage? So I guess both of our predictions about how the Cage works make sense then.
Well at least we'll get one more episode closer to their return and us finding out how the Cage functions after tomorrow night's episode airs. Speaking of that, how many episodes more do you think we'll hafta watch until we get to the episode where at least Sam goes to Hell to get help from Lucifer &/or Michael?
If the mechanics of the angel and demon traps apply to the Cage, just on a higher level to deal with an archangel, then yeah, they essentially would be unable to use their angel powers ((supernatural beings still seem to have control of the level of conciousness of their vessel however, as we saw with Ruby #1 - so Lucifer could easily torment Sam without having to use his powers)). If Lucifer was still possessing Sam's body when in the cage, it's possible Castiel used the Angel Exorcism incantation ((which we first see in 4.16; Alastair tried using it on Castiel but Sam interrupted)) or a variation to expel Lucifer from Sam. *shrugs* Hard to say for certain since we know very little about the Cage at this time.
Well, I can't say for certain since I don't know what's going on plot wise in the current episodes yet. I figure it will be relatively soon, probably when Supernatural returns after the winter hiatus. I suspect there will probably be an episode or two of Sam (and Dean?) going down to hell, seeing the Cage again after such a long time and encountering the angelic brothers (Lucifer and Michael), and then figuring out how to release them and get back topside.
I must've missed that episode where Alastair tried to do that to Castiel or just forgotten about it. Tho that makes sense that he could've done something like that had Lucifer still been possessing Sam.
I'd imagine they'll probably get help getting in and outta Heaven from Crowley seeing as they're such great frienemies with him and how they now seem to have the common enemy in the Darkness. Tho Crowley might be reluctant to do it since it would mean they need to free his old boss and that would mean that he'd hafta probably end up fighting against Lucifer at some point over who is in charge of Hell.
So do you think Michael would join the current regime of Heaven upon his return or do you think he'll try to stage a coup d'etat? (Not necessarily before the defeat of the Darkness) Honestly if he wanted to stage a coup d'etat, I don't think there is much that the angels in Heaven could to stop him seeing as he probably will still have all his powers unless of course the Cage has weakened him &/or the fight against the Darkness will weaken him.
On an unrelated note to the above "Spoiler" Conversation. I found this Supernatural Ani-Gif on Facebook.
Oh, I'm sure Crowley will get involved in helping the Winchesters one way or another, despite his feelings for his former boss. From what I've seen of Crowley and the Darkness' interaction, he's realizing that he bit off more than he can chew and regretting what he's done.
If Michael survives the battle with the Darkness and is allowed to go his own way afterwards, I'm sure he'll try to go back up to heaven. As for whether he'll try to take over as leader or not, it's hard to say. Depends on how the other angels feel about him now and whether he's happy with how things are being run up there or not.
Sorry about the gif. I forgot that you weren't caught up yet and therefore probably haven't seen the ep that that gif comes from.
I want to say something in response to what you said in the first paragraph, but I don't want to provide any spoilers for you, so I'll keep my mouth shut for now until you're ready to read and then respond to my other post that I quoted you in here in this thread last night, ok? I think I'll just add that one into the bottom of this post.
As for what you said in the 2nd paragraph about Michael, it makes sense.
Quote:
SPN S11 Mid-Season Finale Spoilers (Below)
OMFG that was fantastic. Too bad we're gonna hafta wait a while until the next episode.
As Sam visited the Cage with Rowena and Crowley, Dean had an encounter with the Darkness. In Hell, Lucifer of course tries to convince Sam to let him possess Sam. When Sam refuses, Lucifer teleported Sam inside the Cage and then revealed that God wasn't sending Sam the visions, but instead his truly was sending the visions to Sam because the Cage had been damaged enough for Lucifer to use some of his powers when the Darkness was released. Up topside, Amara spoke to Dean about how they're destined to become one since he freed her. She also has a fight with 3 "Fluffy Winged Dickhead" Grunts who she dispatches with the simplest of ease.
Damn I can't wait to see the second half of this season. Well too bad cryogenic stasis pods like in Futurama don't exist because I might very well be tempted to freeze myself in one of them for a few weeks so I wouldn't hafta wait for the next episode that long. I'm as excited as the below random anime character.
I want to say something in response to what you said in the first paragraph, but I don't want to provide any spoilers for you, so I'll keep my mouth shut for now until you're ready to read and then respond to my other post that I quoted you in here in this thread last night, ok?
Posted: Sat Dec 12, 2015 7:33 pm
Prof. Moonie
Kor Saiyajinkami
I want to say something in response to what you said in the first paragraph, but I don't want to provide any spoilers for you, so I'll keep my mouth shut for now until you're ready to read and then respond to my other post that I quoted you in here in this thread last night, ok?
I like that Misha gif. Speaking of Misha, it's perfect for me to quote that gif of him since the below fan humor pic contains Castiel in it.
I want to say something in response to what you said in the first paragraph, but I don't want to provide any spoilers for you, so I'll keep my mouth shut for now until you're ready to read and then respond to my other post that I quoted you in here in this thread last night, ok?
I like that Misha gif. Speaking of Misha, it's perfect for me to quote that gif of him since the below fan humor pic contains Castiel in it.
I've seen quite a few variations of fanart that make a joke about Castiel in that manner. sweatdrop
Posted: Mon Dec 14, 2015 3:33 pm
Prof. Moonie
Kor Saiyajinkami
Prof. Moonie
Kor Saiyajinkami
I want to say something in response to what you said in the first paragraph, but I don't want to provide any spoilers for you, so I'll keep my mouth shut for now until you're ready to read and then respond to my other post that I quoted you in here in this thread last night, ok?
I like that Misha gif. Speaking of Misha, it's perfect for me to quote that gif of him since the below fan humor pic contains Castiel in it.
I've seen quite a few variations of fanart that make a joke about Castiel in that manner. sweatdrop
Guess I should've figured you've seen it or something like it before now.
OMFG that was fantastic. Too bad we're gonna hafta wait a while until the next episode.
As Sam visited the Cage with Rowena and Crowley, Dean had an encounter with the Darkness. In Hell, Lucifer of course tries to convince Sam to let him possess Sam. When Sam refuses, Lucifer teleported Sam inside the Cage and then revealed that God wasn't sending Sam the visions, but instead his truly was sending the visions to Sam because the Cage had been damaged enough for Lucifer to use some of his powers when the Darkness was released. Up topside, Amara spoke to Dean about how they're destined to become one since he freed her. She also has a fight with 3 "Fluffy Winged Dickhead" Grunts who she dispatches with the simplest of ease.
Damn I can't wait to see the second half of this season. Well too bad cryogenic stasis pods like in Futurama don't exist because I might very well be tempted to freeze myself in one of them for a few weeks so I wouldn't hafta wait for the next episode that long. I'm as excited as the below random anime character.
Sorry that it took me so long to finally get around to replying to this. Between work shifts and holiday-oriented events, I haven't had any time to watch any TV shows until recently.
I loved how Amara (The Darkness) kept questioning all of those of the Christian faith on how they knew God was good, loving, and did all of the things they believed God did. I especially loved how she did the whole changing water to wine to prove that God isn't the only one who is able to do such tricks, lol. xd
It was neat to see Lucifer getting to greet Crowley and discuss briefly the fact that Crowley is "carrying the torch". That's one "friendship" I would like to know more about since I knew Crowley was pretty close to Lucifer in the past (back when Sam was preparing to close the gates of Hell with the trials). Just makes you wonder how a simple man like Fergus/Crowley was able to make such a huge impression on Lucifer to be considered a close "friend"; Lucifer never seemed to be as close to any of the other demons he had serving him.
The only thing that bugged me about the mid-season finale episode is that we have no indication on where Michael/Adam is. Shouldn't he still be in the cage like Lucifer? Or was Michael/Adam able to escape because the cage was damaged?
Posted: Mon Dec 28, 2015 5:12 pm
Prof. Moonie
Kor Saiyajinkami
SPN S11 Mid-Season Finale Spoilers (Below)
OMFG that was fantastic. Too bad we're gonna hafta wait a while until the next episode.
As Sam visited the Cage with Rowena and Crowley, Dean had an encounter with the Darkness. In Hell, Lucifer of course tries to convince Sam to let him possess Sam. When Sam refuses, Lucifer teleported Sam inside the Cage and then revealed that God wasn't sending Sam the visions, but instead his truly was sending the visions to Sam because the Cage had been damaged enough for Lucifer to use some of his powers when the Darkness was released. Up topside, Amara spoke to Dean about how they're destined to become one since he freed her. She also has a fight with 3 "Fluffy Winged Dickhead" Grunts who she dispatches with the simplest of ease.
Damn I can't wait to see the second half of this season. Well too bad cryogenic stasis pods like in Futurama don't exist because I might very well be tempted to freeze myself in one of them for a few weeks so I wouldn't hafta wait for the next episode that long. I'm as excited as the below random anime character.
Sorry that it took me so long to finally get around to replying to this. Between work shifts and holiday-oriented events, I haven't had any time to watch any TV shows until recently.
I loved how Amara (The Darkness) kept questioning all of those of the Christian faith on how they knew God was good, loving, and did all of the things they believed God did. I especially loved how she did the whole changing water to wine to prove that God isn't the only one who is able to do such tricks, lol. xd
It was neat to see Lucifer getting to greet Crowley and discuss briefly the fact that Crowley is "carrying the torch". That's one "friendship" I would like to know more about since I knew Crowley was pretty close to Lucifer in the past (back when Sam was preparing to close the gates of Hell with the trials). Just makes you wonder how a simple man like Fergus/Crowley was able to make such a huge impression on Lucifer to be considered a close "friend"; Lucifer never seemed to be as close to any of the other demons he had serving him.
The only thing that bugged me about the mid-season finale episode is that we have no indication on where Michael/Adam is. Shouldn't he still be in the cage like Lucifer? Or was Michael/Adam able to escape because the cage was damaged?
No problem.
I loved it too. Yeah and when she did those things how they thought she was sent by God as his emissary or some s**t like that, which led to her killing them all. I'm really loving her as a anti-villain.
They were "friends"? Hmmm... I don't recall that tho then there is much that I forget about various shows over time. I have to repeatedly watch content to get it permanently memorized. Well then if they were "friends" then it will definitely be interesting to see how things go down between them two.
Ya know there is a 3rd outcome for what happened to them that you didn't mention, right? Lucifer could've won his fight with Michael and killed him along with his host, Adam. Something told me that that was the outcome of their fight when I saw no Michael and only Lucifer.
So what do you think of how she so easily dispatched those Angel Grunts and before that destroyed Deans knife before it even touched her? I thought both displays of her power were pretty ******** awesome. And what about how Lucifer had been the one responsible for Sam's visions? Do you think it's because he still has a bond with Sam as his former host &/OR is it just one of his powers as an Archangel?
OMFG that was fantastic. Too bad we're gonna hafta wait a while until the next episode.
As Sam visited the Cage with Rowena and Crowley, Dean had an encounter with the Darkness. In Hell, Lucifer of course tries to convince Sam to let him possess Sam. When Sam refuses, Lucifer teleported Sam inside the Cage and then revealed that God wasn't sending Sam the visions, but instead his truly was sending the visions to Sam because the Cage had been damaged enough for Lucifer to use some of his powers when the Darkness was released. Up topside, Amara spoke to Dean about how they're destined to become one since he freed her. She also has a fight with 3 "Fluffy Winged Dickhead" Grunts who she dispatches with the simplest of ease.
Damn I can't wait to see the second half of this season. Well too bad cryogenic stasis pods like in Futurama don't exist because I might very well be tempted to freeze myself in one of them for a few weeks so I wouldn't hafta wait for the next episode that long. I'm as excited as the below random anime character.
Sorry that it took me so long to finally get around to replying to this. Between work shifts and holiday-oriented events, I haven't had any time to watch any TV shows until recently.
I loved how Amara (The Darkness) kept questioning all of those of the Christian faith on how they knew God was good, loving, and did all of the things they believed God did. I especially loved how she did the whole changing water to wine to prove that God isn't the only one who is able to do such tricks, lol. xd
It was neat to see Lucifer getting to greet Crowley and discuss briefly the fact that Crowley is "carrying the torch". That's one "friendship" I would like to know more about since I knew Crowley was pretty close to Lucifer in the past (back when Sam was preparing to close the gates of Hell with the trials). Just makes you wonder how a simple man like Fergus/Crowley was able to make such a huge impression on Lucifer to be considered a close "friend"; Lucifer never seemed to be as close to any of the other demons he had serving him.
The only thing that bugged me about the mid-season finale episode is that we have no indication on where Michael/Adam is. Shouldn't he still be in the cage like Lucifer? Or was Michael/Adam able to escape because the cage was damaged?
No problem.
I loved it too. Yeah and when she did those things how they thought she was sent by God as his emissary or some s**t like that, which led to her killing them all. I'm really loving her as a anti-villain.
They were "friends"? Hmmm... I don't recall that tho then there is much that I forget about various shows over time. I have to repeatedly watch content to get it permanently memorized. Well then if they were "friends" then it will definitely be interesting to see how things go down between them two.
Ya know there is a 3rd outcome for what happened to them that you didn't mention, right? Lucifer could've won his fight with Michael and killed him along with his host, Adam. Something told me that that was the outcome of their fight when I saw no Michael and only Lucifer.
So what do you think of how she so easily dispatched those Angel Grunts and before that destroyed Deans knife before it even touched her? I thought both displays of her power were pretty ******** awesome. And what about how Lucifer had been the one responsible for Sam's visions? Do you think it's because he still has a bond with Sam as his former host &/OR is it just one of his powers as an Archangel?
I actually think she was doing the water-to-wine and thundering clouds trick to make them think she was God, not a messenger-of-sorts. But yeah, she is quite an entertaining anti-villain.
They're probably "friends" on the same level as Crowley is "friends" with the Winchesters. However, there definitely seemed to be a different relationship between Crowley and Lucifer than there was with any of the other demons. The other demons were treated like pawns by Lucifer, tools for Lucifer to get what he wants. Maybe that's why Lucifer liked Crowley so much; Crowley has a similar viewpoint of going about things - ally yourself with those who will benefit you on achieving your goals. Sort of follows that whole "An enemy of my enemy is my ally" sort of thing.
If Lucifer had killed Michael/Adam, I'm sure the demons would've noticed. After all, earlier in the season, the demons kept telling Crowley that they were hearing screams coming from the Cage after the Darkness was released; apparently they thought both Lucifer and Michael were trying to warn them or something. *shrugs* But whether that's true or not, it's hard to say, seeing as we don't know how close the demons were getting to make adequate observations ((i.e. simply hearing from the distance vs. actually get a visual of the Cage)).
She's God's sister and apparently has the same level of power as her heavenly brother. God created angels, so it doesn't surprise me that she had the power to destroy them with a simple wave of her hand. And if you have that level of power, basic weaponry that's used for celestial beings like angels and demons probably won't have any effect on someone as powerful as Amara/The Darkness. As for Lucifer, I figured he was going to be the one responsible for the visions, especially since Sam kept seeing the Cage. Since Lucifer's stuck in the Cage, his range of options for contacting people is going to limited, even with the Cage being broken due to the Darkness' release; therefore, it'll be easier for him to reach out to someone that he's had previous connections with. With Sam being a former host and Lucifer's one true vessel, it makes it much easier for Lucifer to contact him than try to contact some random person.
Posted: Wed Dec 30, 2015 6:46 pm
Prof. Moonie
Kor Saiyajinkami
Prof. Moonie
Kor Saiyajinkami
SPN S11 Mid-Season Finale Spoilers (Below)
OMFG that was fantastic. Too bad we're gonna hafta wait a while until the next episode.
As Sam visited the Cage with Rowena and Crowley, Dean had an encounter with the Darkness. In Hell, Lucifer of course tries to convince Sam to let him possess Sam. When Sam refuses, Lucifer teleported Sam inside the Cage and then revealed that God wasn't sending Sam the visions, but instead his truly was sending the visions to Sam because the Cage had been damaged enough for Lucifer to use some of his powers when the Darkness was released. Up topside, Amara spoke to Dean about how they're destined to become one since he freed her. She also has a fight with 3 "Fluffy Winged Dickhead" Grunts who she dispatches with the simplest of ease.
Damn I can't wait to see the second half of this season. Well too bad cryogenic stasis pods like in Futurama don't exist because I might very well be tempted to freeze myself in one of them for a few weeks so I wouldn't hafta wait for the next episode that long. I'm as excited as the below random anime character.
Sorry that it took me so long to finally get around to replying to this. Between work shifts and holiday-oriented events, I haven't had any time to watch any TV shows until recently.
I loved how Amara (The Darkness) kept questioning all of those of the Christian faith on how they knew God was good, loving, and did all of the things they believed God did. I especially loved how she did the whole changing water to wine to prove that God isn't the only one who is able to do such tricks, lol. xd
It was neat to see Lucifer getting to greet Crowley and discuss briefly the fact that Crowley is "carrying the torch". That's one "friendship" I would like to know more about since I knew Crowley was pretty close to Lucifer in the past (back when Sam was preparing to close the gates of Hell with the trials). Just makes you wonder how a simple man like Fergus/Crowley was able to make such a huge impression on Lucifer to be considered a close "friend"; Lucifer never seemed to be as close to any of the other demons he had serving him.
The only thing that bugged me about the mid-season finale episode is that we have no indication on where Michael/Adam is. Shouldn't he still be in the cage like Lucifer? Or was Michael/Adam able to escape because the cage was damaged?
No problem.
I loved it too. Yeah and when she did those things how they thought she was sent by God as his emissary or some s**t like that, which led to her killing them all. I'm really loving her as a anti-villain.
They were "friends"? Hmmm... I don't recall that tho then there is much that I forget about various shows over time. I have to repeatedly watch content to get it permanently memorized. Well then if they were "friends" then it will definitely be interesting to see how things go down between them two.
Ya know there is a 3rd outcome for what happened to them that you didn't mention, right? Lucifer could've won his fight with Michael and killed him along with his host, Adam. Something told me that that was the outcome of their fight when I saw no Michael and only Lucifer.
So what do you think of how she so easily dispatched those Angel Grunts and before that destroyed Deans knife before it even touched her? I thought both displays of her power were pretty ******** awesome. And what about how Lucifer had been the one responsible for Sam's visions? Do you think it's because he still has a bond with Sam as his former host &/OR is it just one of his powers as an Archangel?
I actually think she was doing the water-to-wine and thundering clouds trick to make them think she was God, not a messenger-of-sorts. But yeah, she is quite an entertaining anti-villain.
They're probably "friends" on the same level as Crowley is "friends" with the Winchesters. However, there definitely seemed to be a different relationship between Crowley and Lucifer than there was with any of the other demons. The other demons were treated like pawns by Lucifer, tools for Lucifer to get what he wants. Maybe that's why Lucifer liked Crowley so much; Crowley has a similar viewpoint of going about things - ally yourself with those who will benefit you on achieving your goals. Sort of follows that whole "An enemy of my enemy is my ally" sort of thing.
If Lucifer had killed Michael/Adam, I'm sure the demons would've noticed. After all, earlier in the season, the demons kept telling Crowley that they were hearing screams coming from the Cage after the Darkness was released; apparently they thought both Lucifer and Michael were trying to warn them or something. *shrugs* But whether that's true or not, it's hard to say, seeing as we don't know how close the demons were getting to make adequate observations ((i.e. simply hearing from the distance vs. actually get a visual of the Cage)).
She's God's sister and apparently has the same level of power as her heavenly brother. God created angels, so it doesn't surprise me that she had the power to destroy them with a simple wave of her hand. And if you have that level of power, basic weaponry that's used for celestial beings like angels and demons probably won't have any effect on someone as powerful as Amara/The Darkness. As for Lucifer, I figured he was going to be the one responsible for the visions, especially since Sam kept seeing the Cage. Since Lucifer's stuck in the Cage, his range of options for contacting people is going to limited, even with the Cage being broken due to the Darkness' release; therefore, it'll be easier for him to reach out to someone that he's had previous connections with. With Sam being a former host and Lucifer's one true vessel, it makes it much easier for Lucifer to contact him than try to contact some random person.
I was talking about how they saw her as an agent of God when she did those things and how them insinuating such things made her kill them all. (I guess I didn't include proper punctuation or phrase it properly to get across what I meant.)
Ah okay. Well not having remembered that Crowley & Luci were buds, I had interpreted the "carrying the torch" comment that Luci made as more of a sarcastic one instead a genuine comment.
Wow I even forgot about how the demons kept telling Crowley about how they heard screams from the Cage tho it makes more sense now.
As for the level of power she has, I had already known she'd be as powerful as her brother especially since Metatron flat out described her as being as powerful, just not as smart hence why God was able to defeat her since he outsmarted her. Of course I knew the knife would have no effect, but I loved how she shattered it before it even touched her skin instead of not piercing her flesh. Also loved the way she took out the Angels, it was so awesome.
That thought about Luci being responsible for the visions never even crossed my mind beforehand. That makes sense that it would be easiest for him to contact someone he's had previous connections with instead of some random person and it also was smart to contact Sam since Sam is capable of helping him escape the Cage and most beneficial since Sam is his one true vessel. Also in hindsight it makes plenty of sense that he did it since basically praying to God is like humans broadcasting a message to those of divine power and with him being an Archangel I guess it makes plenty of sense that he could easily hear ones directed towards God.
OMFG that was fantastic. Too bad we're gonna hafta wait a while until the next episode.
As Sam visited the Cage with Rowena and Crowley, Dean had an encounter with the Darkness. In Hell, Lucifer of course tries to convince Sam to let him possess Sam. When Sam refuses, Lucifer teleported Sam inside the Cage and then revealed that God wasn't sending Sam the visions, but instead his truly was sending the visions to Sam because the Cage had been damaged enough for Lucifer to use some of his powers when the Darkness was released. Up topside, Amara spoke to Dean about how they're destined to become one since he freed her. She also has a fight with 3 "Fluffy Winged Dickhead" Grunts who she dispatches with the simplest of ease.
Damn I can't wait to see the second half of this season. Well too bad cryogenic stasis pods like in Futurama don't exist because I might very well be tempted to freeze myself in one of them for a few weeks so I wouldn't hafta wait for the next episode that long. I'm as excited as the below random anime character.
Sorry that it took me so long to finally get around to replying to this. Between work shifts and holiday-oriented events, I haven't had any time to watch any TV shows until recently.
I loved how Amara (The Darkness) kept questioning all of those of the Christian faith on how they knew God was good, loving, and did all of the things they believed God did. I especially loved how she did the whole changing water to wine to prove that God isn't the only one who is able to do such tricks, lol. xd
It was neat to see Lucifer getting to greet Crowley and discuss briefly the fact that Crowley is "carrying the torch". That's one "friendship" I would like to know more about since I knew Crowley was pretty close to Lucifer in the past (back when Sam was preparing to close the gates of Hell with the trials). Just makes you wonder how a simple man like Fergus/Crowley was able to make such a huge impression on Lucifer to be considered a close "friend"; Lucifer never seemed to be as close to any of the other demons he had serving him.
The only thing that bugged me about the mid-season finale episode is that we have no indication on where Michael/Adam is. Shouldn't he still be in the cage like Lucifer? Or was Michael/Adam able to escape because the cage was damaged?
No problem.
I loved it too. Yeah and when she did those things how they thought she was sent by God as his emissary or some s**t like that, which led to her killing them all. I'm really loving her as a anti-villain.
They were "friends"? Hmmm... I don't recall that tho then there is much that I forget about various shows over time. I have to repeatedly watch content to get it permanently memorized. Well then if they were "friends" then it will definitely be interesting to see how things go down between them two.
Ya know there is a 3rd outcome for what happened to them that you didn't mention, right? Lucifer could've won his fight with Michael and killed him along with his host, Adam. Something told me that that was the outcome of their fight when I saw no Michael and only Lucifer.
So what do you think of how she so easily dispatched those Angel Grunts and before that destroyed Deans knife before it even touched her? I thought both displays of her power were pretty ******** awesome. And what about how Lucifer had been the one responsible for Sam's visions? Do you think it's because he still has a bond with Sam as his former host &/OR is it just one of his powers as an Archangel?
I actually think she was doing the water-to-wine and thundering clouds trick to make them think she was God, not a messenger-of-sorts. But yeah, she is quite an entertaining anti-villain.
They're probably "friends" on the same level as Crowley is "friends" with the Winchesters. However, there definitely seemed to be a different relationship between Crowley and Lucifer than there was with any of the other demons. The other demons were treated like pawns by Lucifer, tools for Lucifer to get what he wants. Maybe that's why Lucifer liked Crowley so much; Crowley has a similar viewpoint of going about things - ally yourself with those who will benefit you on achieving your goals. Sort of follows that whole "An enemy of my enemy is my ally" sort of thing.
If Lucifer had killed Michael/Adam, I'm sure the demons would've noticed. After all, earlier in the season, the demons kept telling Crowley that they were hearing screams coming from the Cage after the Darkness was released; apparently they thought both Lucifer and Michael were trying to warn them or something. *shrugs* But whether that's true or not, it's hard to say, seeing as we don't know how close the demons were getting to make adequate observations ((i.e. simply hearing from the distance vs. actually get a visual of the Cage)).
She's God's sister and apparently has the same level of power as her heavenly brother. God created angels, so it doesn't surprise me that she had the power to destroy them with a simple wave of her hand. And if you have that level of power, basic weaponry that's used for celestial beings like angels and demons probably won't have any effect on someone as powerful as Amara/The Darkness. As for Lucifer, I figured he was going to be the one responsible for the visions, especially since Sam kept seeing the Cage. Since Lucifer's stuck in the Cage, his range of options for contacting people is going to limited, even with the Cage being broken due to the Darkness' release; therefore, it'll be easier for him to reach out to someone that he's had previous connections with. With Sam being a former host and Lucifer's one true vessel, it makes it much easier for Lucifer to contact him than try to contact some random person.
I was talking about how they saw her as an agent of God when she did those things and how them insinuating such things made her kill them all. (I guess I didn't include proper punctuation or phrase it properly to get across what I meant.)
Ah okay. Well not having remembered that Crowley & Luci were buds, I had interpreted the "carrying the torch" comment that Luci made as more of a sarcastic one instead a genuine comment.
Wow I even forgot about how the demons kept telling Crowley about how they heard screams from the Cage tho it makes more sense now.
As for the level of power she has, I had already known she'd be as powerful as her brother especially since Metatron flat out described her as being as powerful, just not as smart hence why God was able to defeat her since he outsmarted her. Of course I knew the knife would have no effect, but I loved how she shattered it before it even touched her skin instead of not piercing her flesh. Also loved the way she took out the Angels, it was so awesome.
That thought about Luci being responsible for the visions never even crossed my mind beforehand. That makes sense that it would be easiest for him to contact someone he's had previous connections with instead of some random person and it also was smart to contact Sam since Sam is capable of helping him escape the Cage and most beneficial since Sam is his one true vessel. Also in hindsight it makes plenty of sense that he did it since basically praying to God is like humans broadcasting a message to those of divine power and with him being an Archangel I guess it makes plenty of sense that he could easily hear ones directed towards God.
Oh, Lucifer definitely was speaking in a sarcastic tone when he said that line. There's no doubt about that. Lucifer is practically known for being sassy.
Posted: Wed Dec 30, 2015 10:14 pm
Prof. Moonie
Kor Saiyajinkami
Prof. Moonie
Kor Saiyajinkami
Prof. Moonie
Kor Saiyajinkami
SPN S11 Mid-Season Finale Spoilers (Below)
OMFG that was fantastic. Too bad we're gonna hafta wait a while until the next episode.
As Sam visited the Cage with Rowena and Crowley, Dean had an encounter with the Darkness. In Hell, Lucifer of course tries to convince Sam to let him possess Sam. When Sam refuses, Lucifer teleported Sam inside the Cage and then revealed that God wasn't sending Sam the visions, but instead his truly was sending the visions to Sam because the Cage had been damaged enough for Lucifer to use some of his powers when the Darkness was released. Up topside, Amara spoke to Dean about how they're destined to become one since he freed her. She also has a fight with 3 "Fluffy Winged Dickhead" Grunts who she dispatches with the simplest of ease.
Damn I can't wait to see the second half of this season. Well too bad cryogenic stasis pods like in Futurama don't exist because I might very well be tempted to freeze myself in one of them for a few weeks so I wouldn't hafta wait for the next episode that long. I'm as excited as the below random anime character.
Sorry that it took me so long to finally get around to replying to this. Between work shifts and holiday-oriented events, I haven't had any time to watch any TV shows until recently.
I loved how Amara (The Darkness) kept questioning all of those of the Christian faith on how they knew God was good, loving, and did all of the things they believed God did. I especially loved how she did the whole changing water to wine to prove that God isn't the only one who is able to do such tricks, lol. xd
It was neat to see Lucifer getting to greet Crowley and discuss briefly the fact that Crowley is "carrying the torch". That's one "friendship" I would like to know more about since I knew Crowley was pretty close to Lucifer in the past (back when Sam was preparing to close the gates of Hell with the trials). Just makes you wonder how a simple man like Fergus/Crowley was able to make such a huge impression on Lucifer to be considered a close "friend"; Lucifer never seemed to be as close to any of the other demons he had serving him.
The only thing that bugged me about the mid-season finale episode is that we have no indication on where Michael/Adam is. Shouldn't he still be in the cage like Lucifer? Or was Michael/Adam able to escape because the cage was damaged?
No problem.
I loved it too. Yeah and when she did those things how they thought she was sent by God as his emissary or some s**t like that, which led to her killing them all. I'm really loving her as a anti-villain.
They were "friends"? Hmmm... I don't recall that tho then there is much that I forget about various shows over time. I have to repeatedly watch content to get it permanently memorized. Well then if they were "friends" then it will definitely be interesting to see how things go down between them two.
Ya know there is a 3rd outcome for what happened to them that you didn't mention, right? Lucifer could've won his fight with Michael and killed him along with his host, Adam. Something told me that that was the outcome of their fight when I saw no Michael and only Lucifer.
So what do you think of how she so easily dispatched those Angel Grunts and before that destroyed Deans knife before it even touched her? I thought both displays of her power were pretty ******** awesome. And what about how Lucifer had been the one responsible for Sam's visions? Do you think it's because he still has a bond with Sam as his former host &/OR is it just one of his powers as an Archangel?
I actually think she was doing the water-to-wine and thundering clouds trick to make them think she was God, not a messenger-of-sorts. But yeah, she is quite an entertaining anti-villain.
They're probably "friends" on the same level as Crowley is "friends" with the Winchesters. However, there definitely seemed to be a different relationship between Crowley and Lucifer than there was with any of the other demons. The other demons were treated like pawns by Lucifer, tools for Lucifer to get what he wants. Maybe that's why Lucifer liked Crowley so much; Crowley has a similar viewpoint of going about things - ally yourself with those who will benefit you on achieving your goals. Sort of follows that whole "An enemy of my enemy is my ally" sort of thing.
If Lucifer had killed Michael/Adam, I'm sure the demons would've noticed. After all, earlier in the season, the demons kept telling Crowley that they were hearing screams coming from the Cage after the Darkness was released; apparently they thought both Lucifer and Michael were trying to warn them or something. *shrugs* But whether that's true or not, it's hard to say, seeing as we don't know how close the demons were getting to make adequate observations ((i.e. simply hearing from the distance vs. actually get a visual of the Cage)).
She's God's sister and apparently has the same level of power as her heavenly brother. God created angels, so it doesn't surprise me that she had the power to destroy them with a simple wave of her hand. And if you have that level of power, basic weaponry that's used for celestial beings like angels and demons probably won't have any effect on someone as powerful as Amara/The Darkness. As for Lucifer, I figured he was going to be the one responsible for the visions, especially since Sam kept seeing the Cage. Since Lucifer's stuck in the Cage, his range of options for contacting people is going to limited, even with the Cage being broken due to the Darkness' release; therefore, it'll be easier for him to reach out to someone that he's had previous connections with. With Sam being a former host and Lucifer's one true vessel, it makes it much easier for Lucifer to contact him than try to contact some random person.
I was talking about how they saw her as an agent of God when she did those things and how them insinuating such things made her kill them all. (I guess I didn't include proper punctuation or phrase it properly to get across what I meant.)
Ah okay. Well not having remembered that Crowley & Luci were buds, I had interpreted the "carrying the torch" comment that Luci made as more of a sarcastic one instead a genuine comment.
Wow I even forgot about how the demons kept telling Crowley about how they heard screams from the Cage tho it makes more sense now.
As for the level of power she has, I had already known she'd be as powerful as her brother especially since Metatron flat out described her as being as powerful, just not as smart hence why God was able to defeat her since he outsmarted her. Of course I knew the knife would have no effect, but I loved how she shattered it before it even touched her skin instead of not piercing her flesh. Also loved the way she took out the Angels, it was so awesome.
That thought about Luci being responsible for the visions never even crossed my mind beforehand. That makes sense that it would be easiest for him to contact someone he's had previous connections with instead of some random person and it also was smart to contact Sam since Sam is capable of helping him escape the Cage and most beneficial since Sam is his one true vessel. Also in hindsight it makes plenty of sense that he did it since basically praying to God is like humans broadcasting a message to those of divine power and with him being an Archangel I guess it makes plenty of sense that he could easily hear ones directed towards God.
Oh, Lucifer definitely was speaking in a sarcastic tone when he said that line. There's no doubt about that. Lucifer is practically known for being sassy.
Now that I'm back and Season 12 has already gotten to it's midseason point. Tho since I'm not sure if you are caught up, I'll put everything in the below Spoiler just to be safe.
So what did you think of the Hitler and the President Lucifer episodes? I honestly wish they did more with the Hitler plot by extending it to more than just one episode. As for the President Lucifer one, I was rather satisfied with that. I think they did a good job and it provided a set-up for the Anti-Christ that I assume will probably be done either next season or the season after. Maybe even a few seasons from now if they decide to actually have him/her grow up like a normal kid instead of pulling another Amara.
