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RainBowColoredSuicide

PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 12:11 am
Hi! RainBow here! And RainBow would like to teach all the wonderful people of Why Not? all the japanese RainBow knows. Which happens to be alot!
RainBow will start with some basic grammar skills...
General Tips...
Japanese Word Order

In English sentences words are generally placed SVO (subject, verb, object). Ex: The girl eats the apple. The girl is the subject, eats is the verb, and the apple is the object.

In Japanese sentences, however, words are generally arranged SOV (subject, object, verb). Ex: Kore wa pen desu. Kore (this) is the subject, desu (is) is the verb, and pen is the object. (The use of wa is explained further down this page.)

In general, the beginner can assume Japanese word order to take the form of TTOPV - Topic/Time Object Place Verb.

Just a note on translating here. When beginning to study Japanese, people often make the mistake of translating too literally. For example, a person will read 'Pen desu.', which translates in English as 'It is a pen.'. But, the person will translate it as 'Pen it is.' because they don't allow for the change in word order between the languages. It may be hard at first, but please try not to 'cut and paste' between the two languages. That will only be difficult to unlearn later on.

Articles (a, an, the)

Japanese doesn't use any equivalent of a, an, or the. In translating from English to Japanese these can simply be dropped. In translating from Japanese to English be careful to put the correct article back in though. Since Japanese doesn't use them there may be cases where more than one of the articles is OK.

For example, the sentence Inu wa koko ni iru. can mean either 'A dog is here.' or 'The dog is here.'

Nouns and Pronouns

Most Japanese nouns do not change form as they can in English. For instance, most nouns (with the exception of nouns referring to people) have no plural form. Thus 'cat' and 'cats' are both the same word neko.

There are ways to show there is more than one of something if necessary. There are counters or words like takusan (many/a lot) or samazama (various).

Pronouns also don't change form as they do in English. As an example, she, her, and hers indicate the same person. However, in Japanese she, her, and hers are all indicated with the word 'kanojo' and a particle is used to determine which of the English equivalents is being used. Pronouns do usually have a plural form.

Particles

One of the first things that often throws English speakers when studying Japanese is particles. What is a particle? Well, it's something that the English language doesn't have that Japanese does.

Particles help you tell which part of a sentence is which. Particles always follow the word or clause they modify. Particles really have no meaning on their own; they just serve to modify sections of a sentence. (Some particles have a rough equivalent in English if they are of the 'preposition' variety.)

One of the most basic mistakes when starting to learn Japanese is to 'translate' the particles. Unfortunately there is often no good English equivalent. (For instance, Japanese uses a spoken question mark.) Thus translating too literally will make the English tend to come out strange. It may be difficult for English speakers who are used to every word having meaning, but try and think of most particles more as 'function' words as opposed to 'meaningful' words.

Counters

As stated in the nouns section, most words in Japanese do not have a 'plural' form. Instead different types of things have different counters. This is something similar to saying 'five glasses of water' in English. You wouldn't just say 'five water'. The difference with Japanese is that everything requires this type of qualifier.

Name Suffixes

There are several name suffixes that are generally added to the end of names in Japanese.

-San is the usual suffix placed after names. It is a respectful term. This suffix is kind of like Ms. or Mr. but it is gender-neutral and makes no reference to marital status. -San should never be used after your own name.

-Sama is a more honorific form of -san. This is most often heard in the word okyaku-sama, honored guest/customer.

-Chan is a diminutive form of -san. It is usually used after the given name of close friends or younger family members. It is also used after the names of pets.

-Kun is a casual suffix. It is usually used after the names of peers in a casual situation. In schools, boys will often be addressed by this suffix. In office situations, higher ups will often address subordinates with this suffix.

All of the suffixes can be used for either sex. -San and -sama are also often used after titles in addition to names. The example of okyaku-sama is given above.


~#RainBow#~  
PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2008 12:56 am
Lesson 1: It's a...

This simplest structure in Japanese is the "...desu." structure. Desu is usually pronounced 'dess' as the u becomes silent. Simply put, desu means "It is", "Those are",or "I am." _____desu. It's____.

Note: In Japanese, cat=neko,dog=inu

Neko desu.--->It's a cat. or Those are cats.
Inu desu.--->It's a dog. or Those are dogs.
RainBow desu.--->I am RainBow.

There is usually no difference between plural and singular things in Japanese. To distinguish what is being said, one must rely on context or add and adjective to describe how many dogs or cats or whatevers you have.

To make a sentence a question in Japanese, you add "ka" to the end.

Neko desu ka.--->Is it a cat?
Inu desu ka.--->Is it a dog?
RainBow-san desu ka.---> Are you RainBow? Is it RainBow?

Note that the suffix 'san' was added to the end of RainBow when it became a question. This is because you are reffering to someone else rather than yourself. It is considered polite to add -san to people's names other than your own. Be very Carefull not to add it to the end of your own name though, as it is considered very rude and unusual.

To say "It's not a cat. or "I'm not RainBow." you have to use the form dewa arimasen.

Neko dewa arimasen.--->It's not a cat.
Inu dewa arimasen.--->It's not a dog.
RainBow-san dewa arimasen---> I'm not RainBow.

Note: In the exaple above, you are not RainBow, therefore refering to her with -san is ok.

If someone asks you "Is it a cat?" you can respond with yes (hai) or no (iie).

Neko desu ka.--->Is it a cat?
Hai, neko desu.--->Yes, it is a cat.
Iie, neko dewa arimasen.--->No, it's not a cat.

If you don't know what something is, you can point to it and ask "Nan desu ka?"

Nan means 'what', so the sentene means "What is it?" Do not use nan to refer to people. It is very rude.
Examples:

Nan desu ka.--->What is it?
Inu desu.--->It's a dog.

Nan desu ka.--->What is it?
Neko desu.--->It's a cat.

Lesson 1 Vocabulary:

-san--->polite ending for other people's names
...desu--->It's a...
...dewa arimasen.--->It's not a...

hai--->yes
iie--->no
nan--->what
ka--->particle added to the end of a sentence to make it a question

neko--->cat
inu--->dog  

RainBowColoredSuicide


Zilerate

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 05, 2008 9:47 pm
watashi wa keira desu. Hajimemashite. jyuurokusai desu. Koukouichinensei desu. 4laugh  
PostPosted: Sat Mar 08, 2008 1:48 am
I just noticed from a quick scan that you continually miss spell "ja". There is not such letter in the japanese alphabet. There is "jya"...it is the shi character with a ten-ten on it and a small "ya" character. "Ji"+"ya"= Jya.  

greendew


RainBowColoredSuicide

PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2008 3:24 pm
greendew
I just noticed from a quick scan that you continually miss spell "ja". There is not such letter in the japanese alphabet. There is "jya"...it is the shi character with a ten-ten on it and a small "ya" character. "Ji"+"ya"= Jya.
Yeah, I've been meaning to fix that. I know that the letter doesn't exist... stare  
PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2008 6:19 pm
Ahh, yes, the language of the Japanese. I've seen many other people's Japanese tutorials, but they are simply horrible. I gaped at the sight of them... I already know most of this stuff, so that's how I can say that others had horrible Japanese compared to yours. I can't believe books have been published with bad Japanese. I found one of them in my library. They spelled "Hiragana" as "hiranga" and spelled "arigatou" wrong (which has a u character at the end of it, so it should be spelled with a u at the end in romanji.), and also said that "domo arigatou" meant "thank you", not "thank you very much", and I guess there must be more errors if I take the stupid book to an elite.

Oh, and if you're talking to someone, like if I want to say, "I guess there must be more errors if I take the stupid book to an elite like you" then I have to change you into "RainBow-san", right? I dunno, I notice these things while watching anime.

Perhaps you can add -domo, -senpai, -kohai, and -chama to the Suffixes. Even though -domo is so old... Maybe you shouldn't add it. xD By the way, the proper name for those words are called "honorifics" which, sadly, lacks in the English language. -__-

If "Ja" isn't a character, then what about the words "janai" or "ojamajo"?
 

Chibittsunayo


Moonlit_Butterflies

PostPosted: Wed Mar 19, 2008 7:09 am
Chibittsunayo
Ahh, yes, the language of the Japanese. I've seen many other people's Japanese tutorials, but they are simply horrible. I gaped at the sight of them... I already know most of this stuff, so that's how I can say that others had horrible Japanese compared to yours. I can't believe books have been published with bad Japanese. I found one of them in my library. They spelled "Hiragana" as "hiranga" and spelled "arigatou" wrong (which has a u character at the end of it, so it should be spelled with a u at the end in romanji.), and also said that "domo arigatou" meant "thank you", not "thank you very much", and I guess there must be more errors if I take the stupid book to an elite.

Oh, and if you're talking to someone, like if I want to say, "I guess there must be more errors if I take the stupid book to an elite like you" then I have to change you into "RainBow-san", right? I dunno, I notice these things while watching anime.

Perhaps you can add -domo, -senpai, -kohai, and -chama to the Suffixes. Even though -domo is so old... Maybe you shouldn't add it. xD By the way, the proper name for those words are called "honorifics" which, sadly, lacks in the English language. -__-

If "Ja" isn't a character, then what about the words "janai" or "ojamajo"?
As with the particle 'wo' which becomes 'o' there are certain words in Japanese in which the letter is dropped. If you where to write ____ janai desu in hiragana, you would use the characters jya-n-a-i...but in romaji the letter is dropped... 3nodding  
PostPosted: Wed Mar 19, 2008 7:15 am
Chibittsunayo
Ahh, yes, the language of the Japanese. I've seen many other people's Japanese tutorials, but they are simply horrible. I gaped at the sight of them... I already know most of this stuff, so that's how I can say that others had horrible Japanese compared to yours. I can't believe books have been published with bad Japanese. I found one of them in my library. They spelled "Hiragana" as "hiranga" and spelled "arigatou" wrong (which has a u character at the end of it, so it should be spelled with a u at the end in romanji.), and also said that "domo arigatou" meant "thank you", not "thank you very much", and I guess there must be more errors if I take the stupid book to an elite.

Oh, and if you're talking to someone, like if I want to say, "I guess there must be more errors if I take the stupid book to an elite like you" then I have to change you into "RainBow-san", right? I dunno, I notice these things while watching anime.

Perhaps you can add -domo, -senpai, -kohai, and -chama to the Suffixes. Even though -domo is so old... Maybe you shouldn't add it. xD By the way, the proper name for those words are called "honorifics" which, sadly, lacks in the English language. -__-

If "Ja" isn't a character, then what about the words "janai" or "ojamajo"?
Why thank you! Also, I might add some other honorifics(I learned something!) but, I was starting out slow...

Yeah, I was pretty sure that 'Janai desu' was the informal way of saying it's not...  

RainBowColoredSuicide


wordyrandomness

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 29, 2008 9:13 pm
haha wow you really put a lot of effort into this...
hmm...
kore wa sugoi suredo "thread" desu!
xd  
PostPosted: Sun Mar 30, 2008 2:16 pm
OMG!!!you have to make the second lesson!!

i have an idea! make it about numbers!i mean the numbers from 1-50,how to say:i'm 15 years old..what time is it....or things like that....i hope my idea helped you!  

Hollow_Mike


buwieshingo

Durem Shapeshifter

PostPosted: Sat Apr 05, 2008 9:34 pm
That would be a very good idea for lesson 2.

I've been learning from my history teacher after school since February and with this I can refer to it if I need to find something if I can't get ahold of her. She's also teaching us the kana, hiragana, kanji, and she'll get to the katakana later.

Which reminds me I need to do that little assignment she had us do for the lesson.

Oh I can't pass helping you out Konoha so I'll say this all you really need to learn number wise for know is 1 through 10.  
PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2008 9:05 am
Hajimemashite. Watashi no namae wa Tia desu. Nihon me wa Natsumi desu. Jyuu go sai desu. shumi wa e wo kaku koto desu. Manga ga daisuki desu.
Douzo Yoroshiku. 3nodding

はじめまして。わたしのなまえわテイアです。日本めはなみです。十五さいです。しゅみはえをかくことです。まんががだいすきです。どうぞよろしく。  

DelightfullyMiZerable


Chibittsunayo

PostPosted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 7:18 pm
Moonlit_Butterflies
Chibittsunayo
Ahh, yes, the language of the Japanese. I've seen many other people's Japanese tutorials, but they are simply horrible. I gaped at the sight of them... I already know most of this stuff, so that's how I can say that others had horrible Japanese compared to yours. I can't believe books have been published with bad Japanese. I found one of them in my library. They spelled "Hiragana" as "hiranga" and spelled "arigatou" wrong (which has a u character at the end of it, so it should be spelled with a u at the end in romanji.), and also said that "domo arigatou" meant "thank you", not "thank you very much", and I guess there must be more errors if I take the stupid book to an elite.

Oh, and if you're talking to someone, like if I want to say, "I guess there must be more errors if I take the stupid book to an elite like you" then I have to change you into "RainBow-san", right? I dunno, I notice these things while watching anime.

Perhaps you can add -domo, -senpai, -kohai, and -chama to the Suffixes. Even though -domo is so old... Maybe you shouldn't add it. xD By the way, the proper name for those words are called "honorifics" which, sadly, lacks in the English language. -__-

If "Ja" isn't a character, then what about the words "janai" or "ojamajo"?
As with the particle 'wo' which becomes 'o' there are certain words in Japanese in which the letter is dropped. If you where to write ____ janai desu in hiragana, you would use the characters jya-n-a-i...but in romaji the letter is dropped... 3nodding


Ah, so it's not jya-na-i. It's hard to tell if the "n" and and the "a" are seperated since there's a seperate character for "n" and also one for "na". Well, if you were writing "janai" just from your memory of hiragana and not actually knowing how it's written.

So why is "wo" written as "o" in romanji sometimes? My friend says that writing it both ways are fine but it's really just how you want a person to pronounce it, with the "w" or without the "w". She says it's fine to pronounce it both ways as well. So if one way is fine, then why are there two ways of writing "を" in romanji? Why not just write it as "wo", the way it appears in Japanese text? Well, I always like to write it as "wo", just to not confuse the hiragana for "o" and "wo"... It's the same for "he" and "e".

Oh, and is it incorrect to take out the "u" from words such as "arigatou", "gouzo", and "toushirou" since the "u" isn't pronounced? At some point in Japanese life, the "u" was actually an "o" to prolong the "o" before the second "o"... I never take the "u"s out but is it still incorrect to leave it just as "arigato"?  
PostPosted: Tue May 06, 2008 1:08 pm
^_^! This all really helped me... i've been attempting to learn the language for about three years now... i know kana and i'm starting on the kanji... i know like... thirty of them right now, >_
it's like my goal in life to learn Japanese, i'm not sure why, lol... But anyway... i learned a lot just reading through this! So thank you so much! You put it all in a simpy way, go you!
^_^v!  

S a y u r i S u m i s u


Optimystix

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PostPosted: Sun May 11, 2008 2:12 am
Chibittsunayo
Moonlit_Butterflies
Chibittsunayo
Ahh, yes, the language of the Japanese. I've seen many other people's Japanese tutorials, but they are simply horrible. I gaped at the sight of them... I already know most of this stuff, so that's how I can say that others had horrible Japanese compared to yours. I can't believe books have been published with bad Japanese. I found one of them in my library. They spelled "Hiragana" as "hiranga" and spelled "arigatou" wrong (which has a u character at the end of it, so it should be spelled with a u at the end in romanji.), and also said that "domo arigatou" meant "thank you", not "thank you very much", and I guess there must be more errors if I take the stupid book to an elite.

Oh, and if you're talking to someone, like if I want to say, "I guess there must be more errors if I take the stupid book to an elite like you" then I have to change you into "RainBow-san", right? I dunno, I notice these things while watching anime.

Perhaps you can add -domo, -senpai, -kohai, and -chama to the Suffixes. Even though -domo is so old... Maybe you shouldn't add it. xD By the way, the proper name for those words are called "honorifics" which, sadly, lacks in the English language. -__-

If "Ja" isn't a character, then what about the words "janai" or "ojamajo"?
As with the particle 'wo' which becomes 'o' there are certain words in Japanese in which the letter is dropped. If you where to write ____ janai desu in hiragana, you would use the characters jya-n-a-i...but in romaji the letter is dropped... 3nodding


Ah, so it's not jya-na-i. It's hard to tell if the "n" and and the "a" are seperated since there's a seperate character for "n" and also one for "na". Well, if you were writing "janai" just from your memory of hiragana and not actually knowing how it's written.

So why is "wo" written as "o" in romanji sometimes? My friend says that writing it both ways are fine but it's really just how you want a person to pronounce it, with the "w" or without the "w". She says it's fine to pronounce it both ways as well. So if one way is fine, then why are there two ways of writing "を" in romanji? Why not just write it as "wo", the way it appears in Japanese text? Well, I always like to write it as "wo", just to not confuse the hiragana for "o" and "wo"... It's the same for "he" and "e".

Oh, and is it incorrect to take out the "u" from words such as "arigatou", "gouzo", and "toushirou" since the "u" isn't pronounced? At some point in Japanese life, the "u" was actually an "o" to prolong the "o" before the second "o"... I never take the "u"s out but is it still incorrect to leave it just as "arigato"?


I think "wo" and "he" can be interchanged with "o" and "e" respectively because it could become a mouthful to say stuff if the full syllable was pronounced.. it can get confusing with "he" because ”へ” can be said as "he" but when writing a letter ”へ” is used for the word "dear" so "Aichan へ” would be pronounced "Aichan e" (meaning "Dear Aichan" same goes for the Japanese commonly missing out "u"'s especially when using loan words, for example, 'desu" would be said as "dess" in spoken Japanese.

To my knowledge, its not incorrect to drop the "u" from words such as "arigatou" and "douzo" as there are many types of romanization of Japanese and it all amounts to what kind you're used to.. I use Hepburn romanization this wikipedia on it explains about the particle changes (i.e "he" to "e") and why "jya" and "ja" are both acceptable.
 
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